JC thinking about starting to commence to plan ... table #2

[JCinPA]

NOTE: Updates will be made to this OP so that the current plan is always in the first post.
I would love you to keep posting suggestions/tips/corrections, and I will modify this post as I incorporate your ideas.

Last update after Irish's post #16.[/B]

Yeah, I know. I hold the record for longest time from first post to finished table. (something like 4 years :rolleyes: )I am a little obsessive on the planning side of things. I don't just decide to build a table next weekend and do it. Once I start, a couple weekends and it's done, though. First table is here.

JC - Finished Table Thread - NO dammit, I am NOT kidding! It's really done! - The Perfect Man Cave (http://perfectmancave.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10015)

For that one, I bought suited nails but did not use them. I bought the cloth from Dave Rodda, and I will do that again, he does great work. The first table playing surface cloth is red, like the top image below, this one will be green, like the bottom image below. A matched set.

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/5504/spoker.jpg
http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5661/spokergreen.jpg

The first table was a FULL sheet, no trimming, and it is a HMF (heavy)! I used the center cut from the rail as a stiffener, so it's 1.5" thick in the center. Talking to Irish the other day, he said he has done single sheet tables, where the base sheet is also the playing surface, and it is plenty sturdy. His suggestion was to cut the rail and base to the same dimensions and discard the center of the rail sheet. Since the rail will sit directly on the playing surface I need to put a 1/4" riser under the rail to account for the table padding. I am planning on gluing the center of that to the underside as a stiffener. Irish also suggested trimming 4" from both the length and width.

Before anyone disses this idea entirely, you should know I consider Irish a bit of a table building God (with good reason). And I have a cheap, chipboard 8-player table with folding legs that is plenty stiff. Old-school cafeteria tables were single sheets of particle board with formica on them. So I am convinced this will be plenty sturdy. I may use glued and pocket-screwed stiffening pieces on the underside as you will see in a photo from Keystone Poker Tables below in lieu of the glued stiffener, I have not decided yet.

So mostly what I am looking for are suggestions on materials, maybe they've changed in the last two years. Tips. Thoughts on cupholders and rail width. Check my plans for correct notes and measurements, that sort of thing.

After much cogitation, I have decided to skip the cup holders entirely, either in the rail or on swing-out or sliding devices under the table. I am an old geezer and a traditionalist and I just like the look of classic, plain tables, like this. I will have to do carts, I guess. This is the look I am going for.

http://www.keystonepokertables.com/img/tables/011/04.jpg

and said underside treatment ...

http://www.keystonepokertables.com/img/tables/011/08.jpg


Here are the plans so far.

http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/9180/slide1qa.jpg

http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/2193/slide2bz.jpg

I will get the cloth from Dave Rodda again, at Custom Poker Table Layouts by Custom Poker Cloths (http://www.CustomPokerCloths.com)
Other than hardware store stuff, I will get all other supplies from our very own YAT at Your Auto Trim Store (http://www.yourautotrim.com/) , provided he does not self-immolate or otherwise take himself out of the gene pool while I am in process with this. :rolleyes:

I will edge band the base sheet and I have the nails already.

Supplies:

3 yards of Whisper black vinyl = $51
Whisper Vinyl Black (http://www.yourautotrim.com/black3.html)

3 yards of 2-EO Volara for table padding = $36
2-EO Density Volara - 1/4" Thick Closed Cell Foam (http://www.yourautotrim.com/2eo14volara.html)

YAT 'good stuff' rail foam = $60
Premium 65lb HD Rail foam (http://www.yourautotrim.com/1x54x1060hdr.html)

Another custom poker cloth from Dave = $295 :eek:
Custom Poker Table Layouts by Custom Poker Cloths (http://www.custompokercloths.com)


JC

[Redneck Rebel]

They gonna let you have that at the retirement home??


I am a little obsessive on the planning side of things.

Nothing wrong with that. I spent three years planning mods for my truck on paper after I bought it, and probably at least 6 years of planning before I even had the type of truck I was planning mods for.

[Redneck Rebel]

Why not a pair of 1911's rather than the Peacemakers? Too gangster looking?

[JCinPA]

Why not a pair of 1911's rather than the Peacemakers? Too gangster looking?

No, I just did not connect my favorite gun with poker. I wanted a western-theme for my stuff. I had a thread with the chips Trann designed to match the table, but now I can't find it.

What happened to the custom chip forum, didn't we used to have one??

[Quads]

What happened to the custom chip forum, didn't we used to have one??

We never had one.
We use Gene's forum for custom chips (http://perfectmancave.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=69), as he's the man to get them produced by. Prior to that it was Guma when he was an advertiser.

[JCinPA]

Edit:

Finally found the damn thread, here you go, Redneck.

Looky what arrived TODAY!! - The Perfect Man Cave (http://perfectmancave.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9732)

[Redneck Rebel]

Very nice.

[JCinPA]

Found it, Red! Go back to post #6 and click on the link.

Problem is I have NOT been drinking. That's why I couldn't find the thread. I'm gonna go have some scotch and fix that right now!

[Irish]

Y Irish also suggested trimming 6" from the length and 4" from the width.


Try 4" from both the length and width - 92"x44". Turn up your hearing aid. :mrgreen:

Jumbos if you've got guys who like on-the-rocks glasses. I always go with jumbos because that's typically all I drink at my tourneys - jack with a splash of coke or just straight up. My FIL and another buddy are the same - everyone else is beer bottle but IDGAF. We've been having games for 3 years, several half knocked over beers but zero spills.

The dual size ones are OK, I used them on that burgundy table we had. A lot of players liked them, but the smaller size diameter on the bottom was just wide enough so my JD on the rocks glass wouldn't sit flat. Defeats the fucking purpose for me - I wouldn't get them again for that reason.

Symphony classic isn't too hard to use, similar to whisper. Symphony Vintage is a BITCH and really tough to get wrinkle free.

[JCinPA]

Design is more or less finalized in my head. OP updated with correct (I think) measurement drawings and materials.

My only question is about the cloth. First table design is this.

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/5504/spoker.jpg

I was planning #2 to be a sister table in green like this

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5661/spokergreen.jpg

My chips are:

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/7303/27481476dl1.jpg


I am thinking of shifting table #2 cloth design to this similarly-themed design, with the green background. What do you think??

http://www.custompokercloths.com/images/large/old_west_sign_7_lg.jpg

Maybe one of you PhotoShop gurus could change the background color in that shot to green. It's beyond my abilities.

[Irish]

That table you posted reminds me a little of one of my favorites:

http://www.imgcafe.com/view/uploads/finalpics0.jpg

I think I like the idea of keeping the same logo just with a different background color. Lemme tinker around a bit with PS, brb.

[Redneck Rebel]

I think I like the idea of keeping the same logo just with a different background color.

Me too. I was thinking that with JC's OCD anal retentiveness he's gonna drive himself batshit crazy looking at how unbalanced things are with a different color and a different design.

[JCinPA]

That's the look I want, only with the black metal tubular legs (because I have them already). There's just something about that uncluttered look that I keep coming back to when I think about racetracks and cupholders. That's a stunner.

[JCinPA]

Me too. I was thinking that with JC's OCD anal retentiveness he's gonna drive himself batshit crazy looking at how unbalanced things are with a different color and a different design.

Boy, you've got my number, doncha? Yep, matched set it is.

[Redneck Rebel]

Boy, you've got my number, doncha? Yep, matched set it is.

Well I know it would bother me if I were you. I can't stand asymmetric anything. Only way I would use two designs would be with a main table flanked by two other tables that share the second design.

[Irish]

Here you go. My vote would be to keep the same logo.

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd106/irishpenguin75/forums/PMC/spokergreen_new.jpg

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/5504/spoker.jpg

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5661/spokergreen.jpg

[JCinPA]

Yep, same logo it is. I will update OP.

You photoshop whizzes amaze me!

[Trann]

Looks like a great plan so far.

Don't forget your red and green seating chips. 8)

http://www.abcgiftsandawards.com/images/seatingfront.gifhttp://www.abcgiftsandawards.com/images/seatingback.gif
Ref. Poker Tournament Seating Chips! (http://www.abcgiftsandawards.com/pokertournamentseatingchips.htm)

[JCinPA]

Those are pretty cool. I seat folks with TD, but it's always confusing. If I get these, I can still use TD, but hand everyone their seat chip, put a dealer button at #1 and be done with it.

Thanks for the reminder, Trann!

[Wedge Rock]

Some thoughts:

Good choice on the traditional green felt.

I could go either way on the logos... I'm all for symmetry, but you're also not pretending that you built these tables at the same time...

As long as we're on the topic of asymmetrical tables, I much, much prefer a 6" rail to a 4" rail. It's beefy, but not intrusive. And those extra 2" come from scrap (assuming you are using a sheet or rail padding and a length of rail vinyl -- as opposed to piece-mealing the rail vinyl or stitching the rail fabric), so it's the same cost.

Lastly, I dunno why, but folding legs makes a table look cheap. I realize you already have them, but a pedestal base really makes a table grand, IMO. I also recognize that for non-permanently placed tables, it might not be practical.

JMHO's. Looking forward to seeing this final product sometime in 2015!

[Redneck Rebel]

Lastly, I dunno why, but folding legs makes a table look cheap. I realize you already have them, but a pedestal base really makes a table grand, IMO. I also recognize that for non-permanently placed tables, it might not be practical.


Just curious here but I have a couple questions...
How hard would it be to go with the folding legs now and later decide to switch out for a pedestal? Does this involve a bunch of work to give the table proper mounting points for each type or are is it simply a matter of taking legs off and attaching the pedestals? If different mounting points are required, is there any reason he couldn't install the points for pedestals now for a just in case situation?

[Irish]

Just curious here but I have a couple questions...
How hard would it be to go with the folding legs now and later decide to switch out for a pedestal? Does this involve a bunch of work to give the table proper mounting points for each type or are is it simply a matter of taking legs off and attaching the pedestals? If different mounting points are required, is there any reason he couldn't install the points for pedestals now for a just in case situation?

Not hard at all, you'd have some extra holes on the underside of the table but otherwise you can upgrade to peds whenever you like. The peds are attached to a sub-base plate, then you can screw that directly under the table:

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd106/irishpenguin75/Poker%20Table%2004/IMG_5383.jpg

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd106/irishpenguin75/Poker%20Table%2004/IMG_5385.jpg

[JCinPA]

I'm not using folding legs, fellas. These are black tubular removable legs and actually, they look pretty professional. I bought two sets at once anticipating build #2 and wanting the legs to match, so I have a boxed set in the basement now.

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/5696/bottom1xv3.jpg

[Wedge Rock]

Good choice, sir. Even those legs look so much better than just folding legs.

I like it.

Now about that 6" rail...

[JCinPA]

I know 4" is not enough, but without cupholders in the rail I settled on 5" and I think it is just about ideal. You use 6" without cupholders in the rail, Wedge?

Here is shot of #1 with 5" rail, and I really like it. No foam on the inside edge, of course. Plus, #2 will be 4" narrower.

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/6651/top21gm6.jpg

[Wedge Rock]

Yeah, 6" with no cup holders... 5" ain't bad. Better than 4".

Man this is gonna be a helluva build...

Should we get an over-under date from Quads.

[JCinPA]

Should we get an over-under date from Quads.

Go loooong, my friend. I'm pokey. And though I have not been in the gun store lately, I've been buying radio gear and wifey will look askance on that new custom cloth purchase. This is going to be pieced together a little at a time. Lots of money laundering and favors done for a while.

First wood.
Then padding/vinyl.
Then cloth.

I will likely go ahead and finish the base first since I have the legs, nails and edge banding.

[Irish]

Now about that 6" rail...

Not to worry, he'll make it out to one of my tourneys before this table gets started. After lounging on the 6" rail with padded suede - he'll change his mind. :mrgreen:

[JCinPA]

I just might. Irish, I don't recall seeing shots of a table with a 6" rail that did not have cupholders in it. You frequent the table forums more than I do, can you snag a shot of a full felt table with 6" rail and no cupholders?

I should take a look at it before I start cutting wood, I suppose.

Edit: Mister Shark, this is from your website. Is that a 6" rail? I might go with it. I know I liked 5" a lot better than 4". Maybe Wedge is on to something here. And Irish's suggestions are not to be discounted lightly. I'm leaning.

http://www.mistersharkspokertables.com/Photo%20Gallery_files/IMG_3030.jpg

By the way, I am damn glad I got two sets of those metal legs a few years ago. I paid $39 per set for them, similar products on eBay are now going for $95 per set!

JP Frog, I owe you one, buddy! Those were your find!

[Irish]

^^
Hehehe, there's been an ongoing debate amongst the members of our Thursday night crew about the width of the rail in the above table. I think our final conclusion was that it's between 5" and 5.5" in width (wood width, not including padding).

I don't know if I've seen a full felt table with a 6" rail and no cups either.

[Wedge Rock]

I don't know if I've seen a full felt table with a 6" rail and no cups either.

I have one, but its an ellipse.

[JCinPA]

I'm thinking about the cup holders again. That is why it takes me years to start a table. :rolleyes:

Wedge, if you do have one, I'd very much like to see it. Thanks, bro.

[Wedge Rock]

Dunno if I have pics. I don't host again until May or so, so the table is disassembled and hanging on the wall in my basement.

Hell, who am I kidding. You won't have even ordered screws by May. I'll get you something up well before you start this project.

[MsprinM]

Have we started an over/under on this thing yet?

[Wedge Rock]

I think the unofficial over/under is 2018, but I'm not sure on the Vegas number.

[JCinPA]

Nah, it will be done this year. The over on this one is 2012.

I checked in at the old place (still open for business!) and I joined there in January 2005. I joined to learn how to make a table. I built #1 in Jan 2009, four years and 11 days later.

Now that the mystery is gone, I will get this one done quicker, the biggest delay will be the household money laundering. Get an expense reimbursement check or two and I'm done, though.

[Trann]

Wow, four years has me beat by a looooong shot! 8)

And the old place is doing better now that Gaz has his Admin hat. He's doing some honorable work there.

[JCinPA]

The table forum is great. I haven't checked into the saloon, last time I did, though, there was like four months of posts on the first page. Pretty dead. The table area is much busier than here, though, and there are some truly great builders there. And of course some of them are active here, too.

[SWASS]

What is this "old place you speak of "

[MsprinM]

Is this thing out of sub sub committee yet? When does it go into sub committe so he can then take a vote on bringing it to full committee and then get final approval from the wife?

[JCinPA]

What is this "old place you speak of "

Since you are relatively new (October 2010) you are unaware of what has come to be called "The Great Migration". Here is the link. It has a good table building forum still frequented by many builders here. It is probably best to just poke around there if you like and not start asking for the history of the thing. Enjoy the table knowledge there. And anything else you find there you like. It's probably best to keep with the tradition of not posting much about it. We treat it respectfully (well, maybe not so much) but mostly quietly here, like memories of the dead.

Scott's Poker Table :: View Forum - Table Talk Workshop (http://www.scottkeen.com/FORUM/viewforum.php?f=7)

It is, in fact, probably the best and most active table building forum on the Internet. It was made that way, for the most part by the old members here.

The rest of the forum is deader than Kelsey's nuts. By the way, for those who predate "The Great Migration", I just signed in to poke around. Amazingly, our little April Fool's Day project is STILL HALF of the first page, ALL of the second page and half of the third page of what used to be the Saloon. :rolleyes:

[JCinPA]

Is this thing out of sub sub committee yet? When does it go into sub committe so he can then take a vote on bringing it to full committee and then get final approval from the wife?

Pretty much out of committee. OP contains current plans and will be updated if they change and with progress pics. I want a very minimalist table like the Keystone Poker Table photo in the OP, except I will have the black, tubular robur-style legs instead of folders.

Approval from the wife? Not happenin. This will be a clandestine money-laundering exercise over several months. I'll probably start with making drink tables, then the wood for the table, saving the most expensive piece, the custom cloth, for last.

I am on record as saying this will be completed (photos posted) prior to 12/31/11. I suspect there will be an over/under betting thread on this.

[SWASS]

Since you are relatively new (October 2010) you are unaware of what has come to be called "The Great Migration". Here is the link. It has a good table building forum still frequented by many builders here. It is probably best to just poke around there if you like and not start asking for the history of the thing. Enjoy the table knowledge there. And anything else you find there you like. It's probably best to keep with the tradition of not posting much about it. We treat it respectfully (well, maybe not so much) but mostly quietly here, like memories of the dead.

Scott's Poker Table :: View Forum - Table Talk Workshop (http://www.scottkeen.com/FORUM/viewforum.php?f=7)

It is, in fact, probably the best and most active table building forum on the Internet. It was made that way, for the most part by the old members here.

The rest of the forum is deader than Kelsey's nuts. By the way, for those who predate "The Great Migration", I just signed in to poke around. Amazingly, our little April Fool's Day project is STILL HALF of the first page, ALL of the second page and half of the third page of what used to be the Saloon. :rolleyes:


Jc,

Thanks for the info, I herd people here talk about the old place and wanted to be In the loop.

I am very familiar with "that place" and I've been looking through the forums for a long time. I never posted there but got lots of good ideas and most of my questions were answered there already.

I just wish this poker forum was as busy. :)

I still like this place better though (No disrespect to the old place.

[Wedge Rock]

Wait, wait, wait. I didn't know the RFQ period was closed yet... How can this thing be out to committee?

[JCinPA]

Jc,

Thanks for the info, I herd people here talk about the old place and wanted to be In the loop.

I am very familiar with "that place" and I've been looking through the forums for a long time. I never posted there but got lots of good ideas and most of my questions were answered there already.

I just wish this poker forum was as busy. :)

I still like this place better though (No disrespect to the old place.


Yep, when "The Great Migration" took place everything but the table forum went into nuclear winter. The table forum is most excellent, though. If you are doing a build you should spend time there.

[SWASS]

Yep, when "The Great Migration" took place everything but the table forum went into nuclear winter. The table forum is most excellent, though. If you are doing a build you should spend time there.

I frequent the forums a lot. I guess I need to post sometime .......

[Quads]

It's still a great resource for builders. I refer people there all the time.
Our focus is not, nor has it ever been to compete with Scott's forum as far as the poker table building is concerned. Our focus has been the man cave in and as a whole. Be that a poker or gaming table, we have a section to discuss that.

I do see that he's killed off a lot of the forum, cleaned up a lot of stuff, including killing the builders showcase. Or at least all but one. Including killing mine! It's been due for a good grooming as well, so it's nice to see that it's still active. And like John said, it's a large enough resource that new users continue to use it. As they should.

And when they want to take it to the next level, they come here.
Cause that's how we roll.

[JCinPA]

Interesting. Your builders showcase was in there a week or two ago, Quads, I was perusing it very recently. I think Gaz has done some consolidation over the holidays.

[Irish]

The remaining showcase forums were removed in just the past few days, I think just Big Slik is left. There's an effort going on to consolidate those into the main picture thread, then update that thread so it's more useful. Gaz and Double Eagle have done a nice job in cleaning the place up. Well, at least the table section.

[Quads]

Oh well, whatever.

[SWASS]

I just checked and I guess i joined there back in 2007. I forgot.....

Crazy......